Flying High With Electric Power! The Ampeer ON-LINE! January 1999 The Club Newsletter of the Electric Flyers Only, Inc AMA Charter 2354 Walled Lake, MI, USA Editor: Ken Myers Fly the Future - Fly Electric!

What's On This Site:
Site Table of Contents

President:	Vice-President:	Secretary/Treasurer:
Ken Myers	Richard Utkan	Debbie McNeely
1911 Bradshaw Ct.	240 Cabinet	4733 Crows Nest Ct.
Walled Lake, MI 48390	Milford, MI 48381	Brighton, MI 48116
(248) 669-8124	(248) 685-1705	(810) 220-2297
Board of Directors:	Board of Directors:	Ampeer Editor
Jim McNeely	Jeff Hauser	Ken Myers
4733 Crows Nest Ct.	18200 Rosetta	1911 Bradshaw Ct.
Brighton, MI 48116	Eastpointe, MI 48021	Walled Lake, MI 48390
(810) 220-2297	(810) 772-2499	(248) 669-8124
Mailed Ampeer subscriptions are $10 a year US & Canada and $17 a year world wide. FREE on-line!
The Next Meeting: Date: Thursday, January 7, 1999 Ken Myers's house Walled Lake, MI, Topic; Timing, for directions call (248) 669-8124, Time: 7:30

What's In This Issue?
The Microbe Revisited	Typhoon Kits & More, Coming Soon	Schoolyard Foamie Rating	Message Bases	Fold That Prop
Sanyo 800 Source	Howe Video While It Lasts	A LazyBee Tale	Source for New Type Fuses	It's a Beaver
Shaw on Props	Keith Shaw's 1/4-scale Fokker D-VIII	Twin Star Rating	RC on TV	Wingo Review
S400 Autogyro Plans available	The EFO Holiday Party	The Roswell Flyer	Upcoming Events	Send Ken email

Microbe Info Direct From the Manufacturer
from: Rob Bulk email: rbckits@cistron.nl

I'm sorry, I had promised you some pictures from the E-fly in, but the weather was really bad, everyone kept their plane inside the car and most important I had forgotten to take the picture box with me.
Well it was very busy, very wet, very cold. I did fly a lot and had a great day (fell almost asleep on the way home). I hope to have something for you next time (next year).
I would also like to reply to the Microbe test in the Ampeer from November.

1. Very nice Microbe in the see through clothes.
2. The Microbe is intended to fly with the geared drive (recommended) and is to my personal opinion the nicest set up (spinner, big prop, more power). It can, however, be flown with direct drive, but I don't like this set up, so I did not test it either.
   In the geared drive we don't need side thrust or down thrust and the CG is also at the correct position as in the plans.
   The Microbe can be ground started just go into an empty field open up the amperes and let it go. It will turn around a lot but it will somehow somewhere take off (maybe not your chosen direction). Don't practice this in public. Yes hand launching is the easiest.
3. The plans steps are already changed some months ago, after EFI test.

Here is more recent news on the direct drive version from Rob, the designer. km
Date: 11/24/98 1:02:09 PM Pacific Standard Time

Hello Ken,
About the Microbe with direct drive:
After some worrying E mails I decided to test the Microbe for direct drive, remember the Microbe is not meant for direct drive speed 400.
As I was a little nervous after all this bad news, I tried the Microbe ...., and .. no problem at all. It flew straight and level without any bad habits. It was lacking some power, as with the gearbox and running time was shorter but overall it was okay.
I don't know what it is that makes it have lesser flying capabilities and trims than the geared drive. Anyway, I don't recommend direct drive. It looks ugly with the small prop.
After the testing I wanted to change the Microbe to gear drive. As I was pulling off the prop, (guhnter prop) it suddenly came of and the Microbe fell to the ground and broke its wing tip (another good reason to use the gearbox).
Greetings and happy flying, Rob Bulk

Dear Ken,

Thanks again for the wonderful event back in July. I will very likely attend again next year.
I was flying the 1/12 Typhoon with the car motor in it. I've attached a shot of it flying at its service ceiling. Photo of Typhoon
At any rate, I have some news for e-flyers. HobbyHangar will begin kit production for the entire series of airplanes that this came from very soon. This includes the Hawker Typhoon, Tempest Mk V, Tempest Mk II, and Sea Fury in both 1/12 and 1/8 sizes. George has asked me to include electric conversion drawings on the version of the plans being shipped with the kits. I think it is an excellent idea. I will be suggesting an Astro 05 G or better with a 3:1 gear ratio and an 11 X 9 prop for the geared version (do not omit rudder control!) and a speed 600 or better for the direct drive. In the 1/8 size, these planes should come out about 5 lbs. with a .46 2 -stroke. In other words, they'll be even better candidates for electric conversion. The HobbyHangar 1/12 Typhoon should be in production by Christmas, with the Tempests and Sea Fury about a month behind. The 1/8ths will come along later in the year.
In my Tiffy, I was limited to 7 cells, and had to "leave her pretty wide open" to avoid losing too much speed in the climbs and turns. This is what killed my run times. Much better would have been 9 cells, flown at a lower current setting, but I did get bitten by the electric bug (especially when I zoomed past some "fast" gassies at my home field!). I have a HOB Chimpunk sitting in the box downstairs, waiting for me to assemble it around a geared speed 400. I'll be building the v-tailed Bonanza, as well, seeing as they kindly supplied the plan on the back of the Chipmunk, and the wings are virtually identical. I also hope to get to building a Stubb-E at around 50" span (469 sq in) with the "Tiffy's" motor, speed control and a 1700 mAh pack. The motor runs for 7 minutes flat out on a 6 cell 1700 mAh pack. I'll add another cell and throttle back a bit. The reverse feature may actually come in handy during Lumceveks! The Stubby 100 shown on page 22 of Jan's MAN will come out to all nice stock sizes, if I print it out at 50% size.
Also, if anyone is looking for light fixed landing gear for electric, I have about 80 sets in my basement. 11 X 3 rise good for 3-5 lb. planes, 14 X 4 rise, good for 5-8 lb. planes. Epoxy/carbon with a glass core. About 2/3 the weight of similar sized aluminum (for Stubby 100 carbon /glass gear weighed 9 oz, and over a pound for aluminum). I'll sell 3 for the price of 2. I need the building space!
Take Care! - Ron Daniels

What??!! Give my one and only 5 star rating to an ugly little $23(US) throw-it-together-in-2-hours foamie? You bet. The Schoolyard Foamie (360 square inches, 15 1/2 oz. with typical equipment, 6.2 oz wing loading) is a very basic but carefully engineered little plane available from Joa Harrison in Redmond, OR. Intended for a direct drive Speed 400, you throw whatever equipment you have in it, and off you go. The little devil ain't much to look at, but it flies great. And since, being primarily foam, it is all but indestructible and therefore great for flying backyard combat (which is exactly what I do with my buddy). With a plane that assembles in no time, survives crashes, and costs next to nothing, you can fly free of anxiety in any small space. Died in the wool glow flyers are impressed with this airplane because it truly can do things that theirs can never do. In short, it's FUN.

Many of you receiving the paper version of the Ampeer have commented that you just don’t get the computer things that I frequently mention here. The reason that I keep bringing up this "issue" is that, person for person, there are probably more eflight modellers online than any other group of aircraft modellers. This means that you can contact many of the well-known folks that you read about, and that you can directly ask them questions or express concerns you may have. With brand-new computer prices now under $500 for the computer and monitor, isn’t it time to "take the plunge?" To find out what a $500 machine has to offer, stop in at a Best Buy or Office Depot and ask to see the Emachines Inc. etower, or have a friend with Internet access visit www.e4me.com to get you the information. Hope to see more of you online soon.

EFO member, Bob Henderson, had asked me how to get a prop to fold without a brake on the ESC (electronic speed control). Before brakes became readily available, I used a "ring washer" as an aid in folding a prop. The photo shows a close-up of the prop on my wife’s Oly 100. You might want to give it a try. I got my ring washers at a hardware store.

• New and unused cells. (redundant yes, but people have asked)
• Cells manufactured and assembled in April '96
• Welded, shrink wrapped and glued in packs of ten cells.
• Must be disassembled before use:
  1. Welded straps between cells.
  2. Thermal breaker inline internal to shrink wrap.
  3. 0.91 ohm resistor inline internal to shrink wrap.
• Sold in packs of ten (10) cells only. $10.00 each.
• Shipping: $3.00 first pack.
• $1.00 each additional pack.
• Payment: Check or money order - US $
• Payable to: Jim Porter

Hi all,
I am ending my video business, and have already sold some of my equipment. I still am able to make copies of my Electric Flight Videos, and am offering them for the last time at greatly reduced prices.
In the past, all videos were priced at $20 each (including shipping). I am now offering the following videos for only $10 each (including shipping to US and Canada)!! At this price there is no multi-video special - in other words, 1 for $10, 2 for $20, 3 for $30 - etc...
The ‘96 E-nats is $15 including shipping and is 2 1/2 hours long.
The videos are:
1994 KRC - 1 hour and 47 minutes - VHS
1995 KRC/MidAmerica - 1 hour 52 minutes - VHS
1996 MidAmerica - 1 hour 37 minutes - VHS
1997 MidAmerica - 1 hour 53 minutes - VHS
After this special sale is over (I'll accept orders for a couple months) - I will then also offer for sale the MASTER copies of the videos, including the 1996 E-NATS (2 hours 25 minutes) to anyone who may wish to continue selling copies, and I will provide a written realease to these original masters for use of the new owner with no obligation to me... If you are interested in any of these, just leave me an e-mail at this address: clayhowe@net-link.net And finally... thanks to the many electric people out there who have purchased my videos in the past - it was greatly appreciated.
Regards, Clay Howe

Hi Ken,
Thanks for trying. So far I have gotten one email response from a fellow in Grand Junction which is about 4-5 hours away from Longmont.
Attached is a photo of my "Bee". The motor mount was raised 3/4-1" over stock for better ground clearance with a big prop. While an exposed motor might get better air flow, I preferred a more finished look and added a motor cowling built from 1/8 sq. sticks glued side to side over a paper form wrapped over the motor. The lower front of the plane was given a rounded cross section by building up layers of cross grain balsa, and then hollowing out as much as I dared from the inside to save weight. The rudder is held on with 1/4 scale (large) hinges and can be quickly detached from the plane by removing a piece of music wire threaded through both hinges as a pin. I also recommend LARGE control throws. Speed control is a home-brew based on an HC11 microprocessor. Covered in Monokote. Weight was 44 oz. with 7 cells. 150+ flights and still going.
The plane was originally to be set up for a Master Airscrew 2.5:1 with Magnetic Mayhem similar to what Steve (Minter km) suggested. However while I was waiting for the backordered motor to arrive, I dropped in a SPEED 600 and Graupner 3:1 gear box. The Graupner doesn't have quite as much offset as the MA gearbox, so it's flying with a MA 12x8 electric prop that is trimmed down to an 11-1/2". The LazyBee flew "O.K." on a Tower seven cell 1500 pack. It really comes alive on an 8 cell 2000 matched pack. After reading about Steve's 10 cell Bee, it may be time to give this Bee some more sting.
Depending on how little air there is in the tires, LazyBees can have a nasty tendency to ground loop on the take off roll as they sway to one side and the other. I find it more manageable if the throttle is slowly advanced; just stay on the rudder!
Flying with 8 cells now, Tom Bauer and I discovered that if you take the Bee to the top of an inside loop so it is inverted, and punch and hold full down and rudder ( I don't remember exactly what we were trying to do), it will start to tumble in all directions. Some tumbles are better than others; sometimes you get more inverted spin; other times an end-over-end; every tumble is different. Recovery on my Bee only requires neutral controls, but be sure to leave enough altitude for recovery. My CG is fairly neutral based on hands off dive recovery.

Most people don't think too much about their props, although the prop is very important to the aerodynamics of the plane. There can be performance improvements of between and 30-40% selecting the correct prop for a job.
A prop is a rotating wing with span, diameter and aspect ratio. The materials that make up a prop can vary. The characteristics of the material are important in selecting the correct prop. The way to measure the pitch varies, but in modeling it is measured to the bottom of the prop.
Early props were made of gum wood while many of today’s are made from rock hard maple.
Wood happens to be good at keeping itself together when tremendous forces are trying to pull the blade off from the center. An important safety aspect is to remember NEVER to stand in line with a spinning prop.

The airfoil search was much harder than I though, there have been dozens of inaccurate articles and 3-views. The most accurate is by Ian Stair, has 5 view, and a lot of detail sketches. As no D-8 still exists, except for an Italian copy of unknown parentage, it probably will never be really known. However, interviews with Reinhold Platz confirm that the root was 17%, tip either 9% or 11%, depending how you measure it. By most modeler’s method, it would be an 11%. The mean camber line was the same; at 17%, this produces a very blunt nosed "flat bottomed" airfoil, but at 11 %, the under surface has slight negative curve and an *apparent* wash-in. The best guess airfoil for the root (home design - NOT a Gottengen) has appeared in some ecsoteric articles, was pulled from a side-view photo. I found that a scaled up Clark Y was VERY close to the indicated airfoil. Just reference all coordinates to the bottom line, not the datum line, and multiple by 17/11.8 for the value. This will produce a nice approximation of the root section. For the tip I thinned it to 11%, foregoing the mild "undercambered" appearance. No washout was built in, the wing panel was built flat on the board. The thickness change will cause about a 1 degree wash-out. The Clark Y has about a 2 degree angle between tha bottom surface and the datum line. Blowing it up the 17%, produces about a 3 degree angle between datum and bottom surface, hence the wash-out.
My D-8 flies fine with quite a soft stall, no bad handling quirks. The D-8 must be kept light. My first D-8 many years ago was about a 4' span with a ST.23, weighed 52 oz, and was a bear to fly. About 20 years ago, I built a very light "fun-scale" D-8 57",also powered by the ST.23, a great flyer! About 15 years ago I converted it to electric, Astro 15 geared, 12-900SCR cells, weighs 50 oz, and actually flies better due to the larger more efficient prop.. It is still one of my favorite sport planes. The big 1/4 scale D-8 is still getting sorted out, mostly learning to land it correctly. The tall scale landing gear causes the rudder to blanket and lose authority when the plane settles down to 3-point stance. I find the I need to do a nose high wheel landing, and keep a little power on for the prop draft to keep the rudder working.

Plane: Multiplex Twin Star - Rating 4 stars
This foam plastic ARF looks like a high wing twin motor transport. For $90 US. It comes complete with two Speed 400 motors and props. The engineering is excellent. Parts fit together very well. Without landing gear, the plane is hand launched and skimmed in on its belly. With 7x1700 cells I get 6-7 minute flights with moderate aerobatics. This is a fun plane to fly, has a distinctive and realistic look (once it is in the air) and, to top it all off, the twin motors make a great sound!

Dear Electric Flyers Only members,
Were you aware that R/C TV is airing on two PBS stations in Michigan?

Jim and Debbie McNeely, once again, hosted the annual EFO holiday meeting/party. Debbie had the house decked out in the holiday spirit and ready for us to party.
All of the EFO members in attendance had a very good time and would like to thank the McNeely’s for their great hospitality.
There were lots of photos to share from past happenings. Ken brought several photos from the Ampeer archives and Jack Lemon shared an album of his L-O-N-G career in the R/C hobby. We also watched the tape of Les Garber’s Autogyro - way cool. Thanks Les. If anyone would like to "borrow" this tape, get hold of me and I’ll ship it to you.
While a lot of general plane talk and electric talk was going on, the BIG screen TV was showing Ken’s old tape, Electric Flight in the 90’s, which was actually made in 1989 and featured planes from the mid-80’s through ‘89. It was fun to watch this historical tape and note that many of us there had some very fine flying aircraft "way back then." We really have come a long way baby!
Again, thanks to Debbie and Jim for hosting this fun event.

The Roswell Flyer is a special kind of flying device. It can and does hover as well it flies forward, reverse, up, down and can spin like a top, (not that you want to do that).
The Roswell Flyer is based on four motors, opposed at the poles of the flyer, the motors rotate counter to each other in order to counter act the torque.
There are no servos, your radio supplies data from the control sticks into the brain of the Roswell Flyer. The brains of the Flyer then decides how to slow down or speed up the motors to affect the input that you have given to the control sticks on your radio.
The Roswell Flyer, not only hovers, it flies forward, backward, spins, floats, and in general defies gravity. You control the Flyer with a bit of input and a few beads of sweat.
The Flyer is like flying a, helicopter, and a frisbee all wrapped in one. The Flyer "Brains" also incorporate some very specialized control devices that help you keep the fly by electric system from going crazy.
The Flyer is made up of some very interesting frame material, which has been machined so that the kit goes together in almost no time. From start to flying, it should take you less than 10 hours to complete your own Roswell Flyer.
Who can fly the Flyer. Well anyone who has a radio and a few hours to build the kit. Care must be taken to keep body parts away from the rotating blades. The blades are not made of a overly stiff material but can cause damage if proper care is not taken. The same respect that you would give any radio controlled flying device applies to the Roswell Flyer, an ounce of caution is worth a ton of cure, in short, fly safe, it makes sense, and will add to your flying time.
We are making a production run of only 100 units, which should be out of the skunk works, by December, but we don’t have total control on everything so we will just say the following. We will NOT bill your credit card or cash your check until we do ship the Roswell Flyer. You won´t be out the money until we are ready. Prior to shipping we will send you email letting you know that you are one of the lucky first 100 special people to get to defy gravity and have a great time. Soon after the first shipment of 100 we will have thousands coming on the mother ship, so we won't have any delays. The price for the Roswell Flyer is $350.00 plus S/H. (us funds)
IF you wish to order via mail send checks to:
AFOT INC.
Make Check payable to Impulse, Inc.
7250 Peak Drive Suite 102
Las Vegas, Nevada 89128
To order by phone call toll free at 800 328 0184
If you wish to fax your order use 702-948-1104